15360!!!!!

[ESL]

Hi ALL,
Just got a new record!!!!!!
Here it is....:) :) :) :)

[Adrena1in]

(Sigh)

The most common counter error...I'm sure you're aware this isn't real.

[Enda]

Hi ALL,
Just got a new record!!!!!!
Here it is....:) :) :) :)

I'm afraid as Adrena1in said its a result of a counter error:

http://www.powerballs.com/faq.php?id=16

Regards

Enda
--

[Tstering]

I still not got that counter error myself :D

[Adrena1in]

Me neither, never had a 15360. 18415, and various 15k to 18k scores, but never that "popular" one! :o ;)

[ESL]

I know, i know.I was just joking.:D I knew it was fake though i wanted to see what you'll say :o :o :o
Though i impoved my score today thanks to an advice of Adrena1in in a 1-year old thread from 13270 to 13505.So thanks ALOT Adrenalin.:) :) :) :) :)

Ps: Does this error makes my counter faulty or do you think i'll be fine with it?:confused: :confused: :confused:

[petemayhew]

Counter should be fine thereafter, I mean it won't do that everytime but just be aware that the counter might rob you of a few rpm so always film your runs and stick em' through powerballyzer. :)

[ESL]

Erm, what's powerballyzer?:o :confused:

[pk indrek]

I know, i know.I was just joking.:D I knew it was fake though i wanted to see what you'll say :o :o :o
Though i impoved my score today thanks to an advice of Adrena1in in a 1-year old thread from 13270 to 13505.So thanks ALOT Adrenalin.:) :) :) :) :)

Ps: Does this error makes my counter faulty or do you think i'll be fine with it?:confused: :confused: :confused:

The score you had is fake, as everyone is saying. But what advice did Adrenali1n give you :o

[ESL]

Actually he didin't give to me.:) I was just lucky to read it. Anyway, what i did it's powerballed for 40 min at 9k speed and then went for a speed run. i'm sure many people in here already knew this though i learnt it today and it helped.:o :)

[The Force]

Actually he didin't give to me.:) I just was just lucky to read it. Anyway, what i did it's powerballed for 40 min at 9k speed and then went for a speed run. i'm sure many people in here already knew this though i learnt it today and it helped.:o :)

I must confess that I am flattered by your quote :D :D

Regards,

The Force

[Estereos]

Actually he didin't give to me.:) I was just lucky to read it. Anyway, what i did it's powerballed for 40 min at 9k speed and then went for a speed run. i'm sure many people in here already knew this though i learnt it today and it helped.:o :)

I had the same with my "Signature Series".
Is this kinda hidden feature of this counter. I was also running about 40 min on ~10k then went for speed run...

My previous record was 11140. And first I was really surprised but then convinced my self that this is the counter which I have to trust. I have even placed my scores here in the forum.

Now trust is gone. Also it makes me feel that all these Powerball records of other people are also some kind of counter errors...

Could anybody explain in clear physics term how the hell this counter works? What does it actually counts, how, and what is this magic number 15360? Is it someones birthday or so?

[Bigandyroo]

I knew about counter errors but I never knew there was a "common" one.
Strange...:confused:

[Tilnoom]

Now trust is gone. Also it makes me feel that all these Powerball records of other people are also some kind of counter errors...

If you listen to the videos of 15k runs, you will hear the pitch is clearly different to that of a 12k run. Also running a video through the powerballyser thingy in Adrenalins signature will help give accurate readings.

As for the physics... not a blooming clue :)

Tils.

[hugh495]

physics is easy,just make smaller circles faster.better faster stronger

[LTLFTC]

Now trust is gone. Also it makes me feel that all these Powerball records of other people are also some kind of counter errors...

Could anybody explain in clear physics term how the hell this counter works? What does it actually counts, how, and what is this magic number 15360? Is it someones birthday or so?
No physics. There is a magnet in the ball, and a switch on the counter. Each time the magnet passes the counter it counts it, it does it over a time period and works out your average speed for that period then displays it as your max rpm.
A real score of 15k is obvious just to watch to anyone who has been using it for a while let alone the sound, combine those two and you can easily tell a 15k from a 12k, throw in powerballyzer and it is dam hard to get a fake score on the scoreboard

[Jetfighter]

physics is easy,just make smaller circles faster.better faster stronger

harder
better
faster
stronger

[Estereos]

No physics. There is a magnet in the ball, and a switch on the counter. Each time the magnet passes the counter it counts it, it does it over a time period and works out your average speed for that period then displays it as your max rpm.
A real score of 15k is obvious just to watch to anyone who has been using it for a while let alone the sound, combine those two and you can easily tell a 15k from a 12k, throw in powerballyzer and it is dam hard to get a fake score on the scoreboard

Fake video you say? I can do that! With my Soundblaster I can generate any kind of noise, sound, music, whatever. Fake counter also is not big deal. As about "monster face", I can do very ugly one. I can even speed up the video a little for even more dramatic effect. So, did I count all components for fake video production? :-)

There must be some trust-able and unchallengeable way to measure the rotor speed. The one everyone could trust. World Records measured by cheap erroring counter sure is not the one. Video neither.

What about this bluetooth counter? Does it have the same 15360 magic?

Also I believe that NSD must produce official, championship Powerball, the one for serious players. 350 Hz at least, absolutely errorless and unfakable counter, perfectly balanced and weighted, no funsy flashing and lightning effects. One standard, one Powerball for all! No versions, variants etc.

There must be also clear set of rules of how to hold powerball, what moves allowed and not allowed while spinning, can you use gloves or any other helping equipment. I know at least 3 techniques which allow you to spin it much faster, but I am almost sure that these "techniques" will be not acceptable, because of use of other mussles in you body, and not just hand. For example fixing running hand between your legs in final stage. Or sitting on the char while speedup (this really saves you energy and helps focusing). I can also hold the power ball in absolutely different manner which almost completely eliminates preassure on your wirst...

My suggestion would be that player must hold the powerball in one hand, no hand switching is allowed, and this hand and arm should not touch any other part of the body or anything else like floor, walls etc. But I guess this will require resetting the entire Scoreboard and cancelling all "records".

[RyuKa]

Fake video ? What for ?

And do you really think that for example Akis had been capable to get like 30 countor error, and also 2 at the same time (dual hand record) ... ?
Maybe i you put all your energy for a countor error, you can bypass the check, but just one time ....

[Estereos]

Fake video ? What for ?

And do you really think that for example Akis had been capable to get like 30 countor error, and also 2 at the same time (dual hand record) ... ?
Maybe i you put all your energy for a countor error, you can bypass the check, but just one time ....

1. Anything that can be faked will be faked.

2. I don't say that Akis is not strong, but I doubt that the speed measured is the true one. I believe that they must provide different, more accurate errorless measurement method, which everyone will trust. And this is not for Akis but for sake of true and fare competition where every digit is counting right and could be desiding. Can you immagine Olymic Games measured with this type of counters and speedometers? Accuracy of measurements - that what builds the trust.

[Estereos]

Fake video ? What for ?

And do you really think that for example Akis had been capable to get like 30 countor error, and also 2 at the same time (dual hand record) ... ?
Maybe i you put all your energy for a countor error, you can bypass the check, but just one time ....

And again, if that was just inaccuracy I could say 0K, nothing is perfect, but here we are talking about some SPECIFIC number which is 15360. Where does it come from? why? what is the bug? How many other "magic" numbers does this counter hold in it's EPROMs? These are the questions.

[Alastair V]

I have a dodgy counter that constantly reads 16/17/18k scores when they should be around 11/12k. Great for impressing mates though...

[Estereos]

I have a dodgy counter that constantly reads 16/17/18k scores when they should be around 11/12k. Great for impressing mates though...

And how can you be sure that your real scores are real? May be your other counter misses few thousands?

[RyuKa]

Maybe you are just asking too much questions ... if you wanna cheat then go ... We are all powerballing for fun and i don't understand why someone would cheat if it's not one own level ....

When you get 14k9 many times and then 15k, you know your score is real, even if the countor may have miss some rpm .... trust real competion like Manchester championship to show if anyone is cheating ... u_u

[Estereos]

Maybe you are just asking too much questions ... if you wanna cheat then go ... We are all powerballing for fun and i don't understand why someone would cheat if it's not one own level ....

I don't cheat!

It is NSD's counter cheating. And I am just trying to find the way to measure it right. By the way Powerballyzer might be good idea, I am going to try it, but yet this SW must be calibrated somehow... But, hey, if the score that shows Powerballyzer and Counter on my PB will be close enough so the difference will be no more than 2% I would say OK and will stop noising here.

BTW, is there J2ME version of Powerballyzer for mobile phones? Could be very nice think to have...

[RyuKa]

I don't know but Powerballalyzer does give really close score to the counter's one.

[Adrena1in]

The 15360 bug is a mystery...I believe even the R&D Team who came up with the manufacture of the counter don't quite understand why it happens.

It's a shame when someone gets a counter error, but as people have said, the Powerballalyser is used to determine if the really big scores are real...and I myself am 100% confident that all the scores over 14000, which were achieved after about 2006, when video evidence became a requirement, are real.

There have been people in the past who have questioned the validity of the the highest scores, to the point at which they got banned from the forums for being so negative and untrusting.

It's true that the scoreboard administration does rely on trust, assuming that people out there aren't trying to cheat. There have been a few that were obviously cheating, and their scores haven't been approved...simple as that really.

[Alastair V]

And how can you be sure that your real scores are real? May be your other counter misses few thousands?
Haha i wish

[Alastair V]

The 15360 bug is a mystery...I believe even the R&D Team who came up with the manufacture of the counter don't quite understand why it happens.

It's a shame when someone gets a counter error, but as people have said, the Powerballalyser is used to determine if the really big scores are real...and I myself am 100% confident that all the scores over 14000, which were achieved after about 2006, when video evidence became a requirement, are real.

There have been people in the past who have questioned the validity of the the highest scores, to the point at which they got banned from the forums for being so negative and untrusting.

It's true that the scoreboard administration does rely on trust, assuming that people out there aren't trying to cheat. There have been a few that were obviously cheating, and their scores haven't been approved...simple as that really.
Maybe its something to do with the fact that 15360 is exactly 256Hz. And 256 is a point on an exponential curve? I dunno.

[Adrena1in]

And 256 is a point on an exponential curve?

Well 256 is certainly a pretty important figure in computing, isn't it?

1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256.

I'm just waiting for the relatively new people here to discover the other anomaly, about pressing ON/CLR while the rotor's spinning and the counter showing the "factor of 61" figure, or whatever it was called.

[Animalonfire]

And how can you be sure that your real scores are real? May be your other counter misses few thousands?

The score error is everywhere, it is all around us. Even now in this very room...
...If you take the blue pill the story ends, you wake up in your bed and belive whatever you want to belive. If you take the red pill you stay in wonderland, and i show you how deep the rabbit hole goes. :D :D

[Estereos]

Maybe its something to do with the fact that 15360 is exactly 256Hz. And 256 is a point on an exponential curve? I dunno.

Yoh!

You are genius!

Of course this is programming bug! It is called overflow! These stupid coders probably have tried to save some memory by messing up with byte and word type variables... It is so common in real time programming. I believe that "score doubling" is also programmatic and not hardware as some think.

[Estereos]

Well 256 is certainly a pretty important figure in computing, isn't it?

1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256.

I'm just waiting for the relatively new people here to discover the other anomaly, about pressing ON/CLR while the rotor's spinning and the counter showing the "factor of 61" figure, or whatever it was called.

I don't know who is joking here but my counter today showed 29 instead of 30 in the strength mode when I switched while rotating.

[Rich139]

and today my counter turned into a tree and ran away.

what should I do? I am worried it might happen every time then I will never have a score.

[LTLFTC]

Fake video you say? I can do that! With my Soundblaster I can generate any kind of noise, sound, music, whatever. Fake counter also is not big deal. As about "monster face", I can do very ugly one. I can even speed up the video a little for even more dramatic effect. So, did I count all components for fake video production? :-)
That I would love to see can you knock one up for us pleeeeease. So many people have said they would but no one has. I reckon it would be hilarious. I don't know enough about computing to try. Tim's mini powerball one was a cracker still makes me chuckle

[Tilnoom]

I'd love to see a convincing fake vid. If it doesn't pass the mark, it can be passed as a bad Gyro Jones copy. :D

Tils.

[Adrena1in]

I don't know who is joking here but my counter today showed 29 instead of 30 in the strength mode when I switched while rotating.

Ah, now, someone else had something like that the other day...he said that whenever he went into the Strength Option is showed 28 instead of 30. If this is a genuine fault then it's a very new one. Is there any chance you can show us a video of this happening please? If it's a fault then I'm sure the guys at RPM Sports would want to know about it. Thanks.

And I wasn't joking earlier when I mentioned the "factor of 61" thing. What happens is, if you're spinning the Powerball at around about 3000 rpm, and you have it in the Actual Speed setting, the first score it might display is something like 3065, but that score will quickly change to someone else. Press ON/CLR and if you hold the Powerball at the exact same speed, it will show 3065 again at first. It's another "feature"...the initial score the counter displays will always be in a certain sequence, and seemed to be approximately a factor of 60 or 61. Was weird.

[Estereos]

Ah, now, someone else had something like that the other day...he said that whenever he went into the Strength Option is showed 28 instead of 30. If this is a genuine fault then it's a very new one. Is there any chance you can show us a video of this happening please? If it's a fault then I'm sure the guys at RPM Sports would want to know about it. Thanks.

And I wasn't joking earlier when I mentioned the "factor of 61" thing. What happens is, if you're spinning the Powerball at around about 3000 rpm, and you have it in the Actual Speed setting, the first score it might display is something like 3065, but that score will quickly change to someone else. Press ON/CLR and if you hold the Powerball at the exact same speed, it will show 3065 again at first. It's another "feature"...the initial score the counter displays will always be in a certain sequence, and seemed to be approximately a factor of 60 or 61. Was weird.

I had something like that in Best Score mode too. The first measured score is not easy to drop regardless how fast you run, sometimes it remains unchanged. After having it several times I am switching modes now before taking new measurements.

[Estereos]

I'd love to see a convincing fake vid. If it doesn't pass the mark, it can be passed as a bad Gyro Jones copy. :D

Tils.

Hey guys, I can easily kill someone on the street with a kitchen knife but it doesn't mean I will do that. And not because I am afraid or something but because I don't feel right about it. The same thing I feel about shooting fake powerball video.

But it doesn't mean that it is impossible. Talk to any Video or Sound Editor and he will tell you that it is not a big problem. For commercial movies they do much more complicated editing.

[LTLFTC]

Hey guys, I can easily kill someone on the street with a kitchen knife but it doesn't mean I will do that. And not because I am afraid or something but because I don't feel right about it. The same thing I feel about shooting fake powerball video.

But it doesn't mean that it is impossible. Talk to any Video or Sound Editor and he will tell you that it is not a big problem. For commercial movies they do much more complicated editing.
I don't mean try and cheat I'd just love to see a "fake" video that looks legit as I don't think it can be done

[Estereos]

I'd love to see a convincing fake vid. If it doesn't pass the mark, it can be passed as a bad Gyro Jones copy. :D

Tils.

You must understand something, I am not a challenger or something, I am a f-ing victim. I was fooled by NSD Powerball, foolishly placed my foolish scores up here, foolishly told about it to my wife, my son, my friends. And you must understand how do I feel now. I am simply f-d.

Now with my shame and my personal problems I will deal myself but I don't want to be fooled again. And I really hope that NSD or whoever out there will take serious responsibility and will fix these bugs.

It will be also nice to get new errorless counter free to everyone who evere reported these bugs.

That is the only point of MHO.

[Estereos]

I don't mean try and cheat I'd just love to see a "fake" video that looks legit as I don't think it can be done

Some people thought that things heavier than air can't fly, that was just before airplane invention.

Anything is possible if you will try harder. And you as PB-er must know that better than anybody else.

[Adrena1in]

The first measured score is not easy to drop regardless how fast you run, sometimes it remains unchanged.

Bit odd...mine always gets updated if I spin faster. However, out of habit, I always press ON/CLR before each run.

As for the whole faking of the video, it's not as easy as you might think. Yes, it's possible to increase the sound frequency, but a keen eye can tell if the sound doesn't match the Powerballer motion. Increase the visual speed too and it'll become obvious, even with a small increase I think. It does lead me to my worries about the YouTube-type videos, where the visual quality isn't very good, and is sometimes so poor you can't see the Powerballer moving at all. In those cases I do worry that faking the video is possible.

But as others have said, people have made claims in the past about being able to cheat, and so far we've not seen it happen. At least I don't think we have. Seriously, if you are able to fool us then we'd be keen to see your efforts, so that we can perhaps find ways to combat it. A bit like a bank asking a thief to rob the bank so that tne bank can find where their weaknesses are! ;)

[Estereos]

Bit odd...mine always gets updated if I spin faster. However, out of habit, I always press ON/CLR before each run.

As for the whole faking of the video, it's not as easy as you might think. Yes, it's possible to increase the sound frequency, but a keen eye can tell if the sound doesn't match the Powerballer motion. Increase the visual speed too and it'll become obvious, even with a small increase I think. It does lead me to my worries about the YouTube-type videos, where the visual quality isn't very good, and is sometimes so poor you can't see the Powerballer moving at all. In those cases I do worry that faking the video is possible.

But as others have said, people have made claims in the past about being able to cheat, and so far we've not seen it happen. At least I don't think we have. Seriously, if you are able to fool us then we'd be keen to see your efforts, so that we can perhaps find ways to combat it. A bit like a bank asking a thief to rob the bank so that tne bank can find where their weaknesses are! ;)

Now the question is how much you will pay for that?
Banks give good money, you know... Specially when they are robbed.
:cool:

[LTLFTC]

You must understand something, I am not a challenger or something, I am a f-ing victim. I was fooled by NSD Powerball, foolishly placed my foolish scores up here, foolishly told about it to my wife, my son, my friends. And you must understand how do I feel now. I am simply f-d.

Now with my shame and my personal problems I will deal myself but I don't want to be fooled again. And I really hope that NSD or whoever out there will take serious responsibility and will fix these bugs.

It will be also nice to get new errorless counter free to everyone who evere reported these bugs.

That is the only point of MHO.
I can see your point, when you first start powerballing you can't appreciate how much harder a 15k score is it is only after working your but off anf making improvements and finding each one is exponentially harder that you realise it. A 13-14k er who has been at it a while could never confuse a 1530 score with a regular score. A noob could be rather excited. No shame though.

[RyuKa]

Just for the 256 exponential thing ... it can also explain why there are so few scores between 15350 and 15600 ^^

And Estereos, in my opinion, you are not a victim, you are just splitting hairs ...

[Estereos]

And Estereos, in my opinion, you are not a victim, you are just splitting hairs ...

No, I like when it is shaved off clean.

[charette]

No, I like when it is shaved off clean.

I would be twice as disapointed as you if someone can reach 15k3 after only one week of powerballing! :D
My advice is don't take it so seriously and train for some months and you'll manage to get 15k as many guys here and it'll be an achievement which you could be very/really proud of !
"We don't have anything without doing something":)
"On a rien sans rien" en francais;)

[Estereos]

I would be twice as disapointed as you if someone can reach 15k3 after only one week of powerballing! :D


Yeah, I do Nunchakus for last 30 years and I know how right you are.
:)

[Estereos]

RPM Sports has responded to my request with nice letter!
So I really believe that my Counter problem will be soon resolved and I will be happy and nice guy again. :):):)

[RyuKa]

I will be happy and nice guy again. :):):)

Glad to hear that ! And keep spinning :)

[Estereos]

Glad to hear that ! And keep spinning :)
There are other things I spin, it looks even more dangerous :D


http://beasticks.tripod.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/ani1_trans1.gif

[RyuKa]

You must be impressive :) Take a video next time and upload it on Youtube for us to see you :p

[Estereos]

You must be impressive :) Take a video next time and upload it on Youtube for us to see you :p

You can see my son ... Who is my student also...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5m7XctQG8I

[LTLFTC]

You can see my son ... Who is my student also...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5m7XctQG8I
You must be good if you've done that for 30 years and still managed to have a son:p

[Estereos]

You must be good if you've done that for 30 years and still managed to have a son:p

Are You about "hurting yourself" thing?

That happens only to people practicing by them selves and trying to do tricks they are not ready for. With good teacher and right instructions it will never happen. As it didn't happen to me and neither to any of my students.

[LTLFTC]

Are You about "hurting yourself" thing?

That happens only to people practicing by them selves and trying to do tricks they are not ready for. With good teacher and right instructions it will never happen. As it didn't happen to me and neither to any of my students.
That's good as it looks like a vasectomy in the waiting. I would want mine covered in bubble wrap I think, the nunchucks that is:)

[Tilnoom]

I would have thought you'd have wanted the rest of you covered in bubble wrap too!

[Adrena1in]

Was it Enter the Dragon that inspired you, as that's getting on for 30 years old isn't it? After seeing it as a kid I went to London with a mate, to Chinatown, and bought some of those foam Nunchakus. We practised for ages, and although we only did a maximum of three or four "moves", we soon felt we were getting really fast and it felt safe...never hitting ourselves. So I made a wooden pair and promptly smacked myself in the head. Silly boy. :rolleyes:

Your son's got potential that's for sure. Do you compete in Kata competitions or what have you?

[Estereos]

That's good as it looks like a vasectomy in the waiting. I would want mine covered in bubble wrap I think, the nunchucks that is:)

Seriously, it all depends on who is teaching you.
I never push my students for complex and dangerous moves and tricks, I give them tasks only when they are ready. I explain in details what and how should they do the trick, what are possible mistakes and how to avoid them. When it is really dangerous they always start with special foam nunchakus (not the one some can buy on internet).

All of our nunchakus are different and made specially for ours style, you can't by it, you receive it only when you become member of our club.
You can see some on my website www.beastick.com

BTW, you can hurt yourself and even kill somebody also with foam nunchakus, power here is not in material but in the speed, same as for Powerball I guess.

[Estereos]

Was it Enter the Dragon that inspired you, as that's getting on for 30 years old isn't it? After seeing it as a kid I went to London with a mate, to Chinatown, and bought some of those foam Nunchakus. We practised for ages, and although we only did a maximum of three or four "moves", we soon felt we were getting really fast and it felt safe...never hitting ourselves. So I made a wooden pair and promptly smacked myself in the head. Silly boy. :rolleyes:

Your son's got potential that's for sure. Do you compete in Kata competitions or what have you?

Bruse Lee. After I saw it first time nothing could help my obsession about it.

I am afraid the same story will repeat with Powerball. Why there is no movie with Powerball? I could have know about it 5-8 years earlier, when I was bit younger. :-)

[Estereos]

Must say that RPM Sports have responded on my problem very quickly and they have already sent to me replacement counter.

Thank You, guys!
I appreciate it very much!

[LTLFTC]

Must say that RPM Sports have responded on my problem very quickly and they have already sent to me replacement counter.

Thank You, guys!
I appreciate it very much!
There service is definitely second to none